Anand Giridharadas: ‘What Is Offered By Donald Trump and the Republican Party Today Is Fascism’

GEIST: “... should be handled very easily by the National Guard or the military. So Anand, a couple of days ago you were here, we were talking about Kamala Harris going into these places like Fox News, maybe going on Joe Rogan’s podcast and sitting there and talking policy and taking the heat and coming out and benefiting her. Do you think that benefited her yesterday?”
Giridharadas: “Yeah. I think, you know, it was a rich policy discussion if you dug into it, but I think what most people are looking for is more visceral than that. People are looking for whether you have the metal to smash the obstacles in their lives that they can’t smash on themselves, which they need leaders to smash for them. And I think that kind of thing, when you’re up against that, it shows that to people. To pick up on a couple of things Mika said I thought were really important. I loved Mika that you used the word fascism, the —“
BRZEZINSKI: “Mm-hmm.”
Giridharadas: “— the other F word, the F word of this moment, because I think many of us in the media, particularly a lot of the newspapers, have been very, very reluctant to say what is clear, right? A tree is a tree —“
BRZEZINSKI: “Yes.”
Giridharadas: “— a river is a river and fascism is fascism. It is a word with a dictionary definition. And if —“
BRZEZINSKI: “Yeah.”
Giridharadas: “— a tree is a tree, fascism is fascism. And this offered by — what is offered by Donald Trump and the Republican Party today is fascism. And we in the media need to say it. And the other thing that Mika brought up, which I just wanted to, you know, expand on for a second, is this notion of interruption, right? It was — it was a — it was just a — it was a tick in that interview, but it was almost interruptionism last night. I was watching this —“
BRZEZINSKI: “Mm-hmm.”
Giridharadas: “— and it was like, this is — this is interruption as an art form, interruption. And it felt like — it started to feel like interruption as a metaphor for a rising new America, a new generation of leadership, a woman, a person of color in Kamala Harris, trying to speak. And this kind of figure of the old guard who was offended at the notion that her voice had a volume, right, that her vocal cords —“
BRZEZINSKI: “Yeah.”
Giridharadas: “— made sound, invited her on the show and then was very, very angry that he could hear her. And it just felt like a metaphor for a minority in this country that is angry at the notion that a rising, pluralist, more pluralist new America is speaking, is around, is here, and a desire to interrupt not just the person but the future. And I actually don’t think the future will be interrupted. And I think a lot of people who watch Fox News even have experienced that in meetings, have experienced that at work —“
BRZEZINSKI: “Yeah.”
Giridharadas: “— have experienced that all their lives in different forms, and don’t like it, whatever their policy views are.”